Chris McGowan is the founder and CEO of ThunderLabs, an Australian firm working across digital experiences, customer identity, and specialist recruitment. Before building ThunderLabs, Chris spent years inside the recruitment industry—giving him a front-row view of how organisations actually coordinate work, reward competence, and quietly fail when hierarchy substitutes for judgment.
In this conversation, we examine what happens when you remove general managers and formal executive layers—and what must replace them if the organisation is to function. Chris explains how ThunderLabs operates through informal leadership, discretionary boundary spanning, and high-trust expertise, and why recruitment becomes the central strategic lever in a system built on autonomy rather than control.
In This Episode, We Cover
- Why traditional hierarchy often becomes an information bottleneck rather than a coordination mechanism
- How informal leadership works in practice—without collapsing into politics or anarchy
- What discretionary boundary spanning looks like on a normal working day
- Why recruitment becomes existential in high-autonomy organisations
- The kinds of people who thrive (and fail) in manager-light systems
- What leaders inside traditional hierarchies can apply immediately, without structural permission
Guest Links & References
- Chris McGowan: chris-thunderlabs
- ThunderLabs: www.thunderlabs.com.au
About the Show
On the Subject of Leadership is a long-form conversation series for leaders, aspiring leaders, and anyone interested in how authority, competence, and influence actually work.
Hosted by Dr Robert N. Winter.
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Credits / Disclosures
- Recorded remotely via Riverside
- Music: The Hidden Thread by Roberto Prado / Artlist